Life in the IEP Tribe
Join us as we dive into the world of special education with two educators who have walked the same path as many of you. In addition to teaching in self-contained and collaborative settings, our hosts bring a unique perspective to the challenges and triumphs of raising a special needs child. From classroom strategies to heartfelt family moments, they offer practical advice, empathy, and a community of support. Discover how their personal experiences can shed light on your journey and gain valuable insights into navigating the complexities of special education both in and out of the classroom. Welcome to the tribe!
Life in the IEP Tribe
Reunited: Starting Season Two with Fresh Energy
Back with renewed energy for season two! After a whirlwind summer filled with unexpected adventures—including camping mishaps involving ninja trees and discovering they're woefully unprepared for tent camping in Florida's scorching heat—they're diving back into the podcast with fresh perspectives from their new professional roles.
As the school year kicks into gear, behavior challenges emerge as students readjust to classroom structures after months of summer freedom. These transition periods reveal a universal truth in education: resistance is natural when expectations shift. For students with special needs, this adjustment can be particularly difficult as they navigate new routines, teachers, and demands. The hosts explore how seemingly minor issues—a fallen sock, tight shoelaces, or sensory discomfort—can trigger significant behavioral responses in children.
The heart of effective behavior management lies in collaborative parent-teacher relationships. Rather than approaching meetings determined to convince each other they're right, both parties benefit from asking questions and genuinely listening. "What do you see for your child?" becomes a transformative question that reveals differing yet equally important perspectives. When parents and educators align their goals and understand each other's viewpoints, they create a unified team that truly supports student success. Remember, every child deserves advocates who prioritize their well-being, whether they have formal diagnoses or not. As one wise t-shirt reminds us: "Be kind, because you never know what another person is going through."
I am so excited I was trying to figure out what kind of yell that was. I don't know if you like saw a frog or a lizard, or if you were excited. Right, no, I, no, I'm just like super excited.
Speaker 1:I feel like we haven't done this in forever and we are embarking on what we're calling our second season, so I'm super excited. Not only am I super excited about that, but we've had quite the whirlwind of a summer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, which started out with like zero or not zero, but like two things on the agenda, and it ended up with multiple fun things that we got to do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think like a week before school finished, the entirety of our plan was like making our annual trip to Virginia and having our annual get together with the Curtis family somewhere, right, and then next thing you know we're like we were. We were gone for a week and we're back for a week. And we're gone for a week and we're back for a week and again like gone. I don't know, I lost count, but anyway we got to do some really great things though.
Speaker 2:We did.
Speaker 1:Like we and it's it's no secret.
Speaker 1:The team that we worked with is super cool and we love them so much and they were always very, very, very good to us.
Speaker 1:And yeah, I keep saying was, and we'll explain that later but they gifted us some camping trips that were so much fun and kind of weird, right, yeah, I mean, there was the backing into a tree, okay, so listen, I don't know if I'm getting old and just can't hear, right, or I would like to blame the vehicle, but okay, so here we are in this campsite and it was a really great campsite down in St Augustine and we had this idea that, instead of having to back out into the road, why don't we back in to the campsite so that we can just pull on out, right, right, makes sense. So I go to back up the behemoth of the vehicle that we drive. The thing is huge, it's a super long expedition and and it has the little bb thing when things are in the way. But this tree had this like crazy crook to it and yeah, I'm I'm kind of making a gesture with my hands that nobody can see, but it has this crook to it that while I'm backing up I didn't hear the beepy thing.
Speaker 2:I'm looking at the, the camera and the screen and it was didn't help that the tree was in the bushes yeah, stupid tree.
Speaker 1:So the tree was being like a ninja tree. It wasn't even like a normal tree that just hangs out and has leaves. It was hiding, almost like now I'm not trying to start anything, but it's almost like it wanted to hide and hit the truck. So we back into it and all of a sudden you hear and busted out the window and that was weird. But other than that everything was really great, like we had a really good time yes, we did. Would you like to elaborate on that?
Speaker 2:Hey, I think my brain needs to get back in like all kinds of shape after the summer. I need to get back in work shape. I need to get back in school shape. I need to, I guess, get back in talking shape, talking shape.
Speaker 2:Talking shape for this, all right, so yeah, that trip was down to St Augustine Beach and, like you said, the team that we worked with last year gifted us a week there. We'd never camped down there before, and it was one of those bucket list sites that we wanted to check out. Now, the other thing we'd never done we tent camped in Florida in the summer, and as much fun as we had, we sweat the entire time to the point where we had a portable air conditioner and we realized that our tent had these screens that didn't close, and so we spent some of our time making making screens closers that the air conditioner would work better, and so then we realized that Though we're sad, that's what we realized.
Speaker 1:We do not know how to camp, like if the end of the world started. I don't mean like the end of the world like it exploded, but I mean, let's just for a minute imagine us in, you know, like the Walking Dead kind of setting. We're done Kurti, we're going to be laying out on the ground sweating to death, hoping to get eaten by zombies.
Speaker 2:Unless we got a beach to go to, because the beach was great.
Speaker 1:Oh, that did work out, didn't it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, the beach was great. We could go and cool off and have a good time. However, one really cool thing we did learn on that trip is that okay, so we might want to look into a camper if we plan on doing this more in the summertime, because it was great and going to the beach was great and if I'm near water, I'm happy. So we decided that for the next fabulous trip that they gifted us to Santee, south Carolina, that we probably wanted something with some air conditioning. Yeah, our creature comforts. Yeah, that is pretty sad, but it was a lot of fun.
Speaker 1:It was a lot of good times. So, hey, listen, let us know about your summer stuff. You can talk to us on Facebook, you can shoot us an email to lifeintheeptribe at gmailcom and, yeah, tell us about some of your fun times. Now let's back up a little bit more and talk about our change of scenery. Yep, that silence was on purple.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, because it happened much like the summer filling up, it all happened very fast.
Speaker 2:It's all your fault.
Speaker 1:Well, it is my fault and I'll take the blame for that. I don't mind, that's okay. So anybody that has hung around you for the last I don't know five years, that has hung around you for the last I don't know five years, knows that you really, really, really enjoyed your time hanging out at the middle school when you were doing your practicum hours for school, right, and I think you were. How long were you there?
Speaker 2:I think I only did 40 hours Okay In one of the semesters.
Speaker 1:But I think it was my second third year in school. Did you say?
Speaker 2:your second, third year, second, or third year. Oh, second or third year I was like what is a second, third year.
Speaker 2:I think it was during my third year and I had to go over there to do more to do my hours for the um, my degree, and luckily that I got to you know, got to see and work with, got to be in the classroom with one of Xander's teachers but also got to pick the brain of a Xander's other teacher while that he was there and I just really liked the time there. I like the things that they got to work the brain of a Sanders other teacher while that he was there and I just really liked the time there. I liked the things that they got to work on Providing the more of the life skills part of special education going on the. I got to go on one of the community-based outings one time and so I just felt like that was more. I was more suited for that. But, like I said, anybody like you said, anybody that knows me knows. I said that. But I also said if you decide you're pursuing other things, then this is what I'm doing. But that's not really how it happened.
Speaker 1:No, no, it got kind of weird. So it was literally the last day of school and that opening was sent out is that the right way to say it? Distributed amongst those who work in the school system a vacancy and yeah and so I saw it and I thought, oh my goodness, you know, here's an opening to the middle school and and I know that laura had some interest in that, and so I was like, hey, check it out. Um, and she did, and that's where she ended up yep I mean, it happened like less than less than a week.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was a quick turnaround and so, you know, with Laura leaving, I got to, and so I got to thinking about my situation in life and, and with us going back to school again, we're finishing up some degrees here within the next couple of years, and for me to have a change of scenery as far as, like, my responsibility, the things that have some responsibility, changes that would allow me more flexibility and what's the word I'm looking for, like I don't know put myself in a different setting so I could focus on finishing up this degree that's coming along because, goodness knows, I need all the help that I can get. So with that, I ended up moving to another school to do collaborative teaching and, for anybody that does not know what that means, I still work with kids that have IEPs. I just push into the Gen N classroom and work with them there, and I got to tell you we've been back in school for two and a half weeks and it's been really great. It's been neat getting to meet new kids and new teachers and make more connections, and so one of the things that we're really excited about is the pool from which we can gain more understanding and knowledge about the world of IEP, not just the you know the paperwork side of it and all of that, but everything that comes along with students that have special needs, and we know that it's incredibly multifaceted, right.
Speaker 1:So you know with kids that you never know what supports they need in the beginning, and then, the more you work with them, their supports needs change. Sometimes you know what they were needing support with. On this day they no longer need that support, and so now we have to find other people who have other specialties, and so the plan for season two is to continue with a lot of those interviews and bringing in specialists. And because, at the end of the day, our whole goal in everything that we do is to provide support, everybody wants to know that they're supported and everybody wants to feel supported, and we know that, again, there's so many people that are involved in the life of a student that has special needs that nobody is a specialist in everything.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:And so yeah, so the more that we can gather, the more that we can bring together and maybe kind of produce this kind of a one-stop shop to at least point people in a direction that have different concerns or questions. I think that would be a great thing. So how has the beginning of your year been? I just talked a little bit about mine and how exciting it's been, but tell me some more about yours.
Speaker 2:Mine's been good. It's been really good and got to meet some new kids, also have some familiar faces where I am, some of the students that I've known for a long time and got to see some that I hadn't, that had moved on and then came back to. I came over to the middle school after elementary and so that's been great. It's been great working with the teachers I'm working, working with and they have a lot of knowledge and um, but it it's just been, it's been a different learning curve. But, uh, as far as you know, realize that some of my materials that I've brought over like, okay, let's, yeah, so these kids know all this.
Speaker 2:So let me find I'm on the search for some, uh, more materials for sure, um, I was fortunate that um, two of the, the paras that we worked with, had um also applied and came over with me and so I get to work with them because as a team, that is one of the harder things, and I was fortunate that I didn't have to start the year learning a new school, learning new students, learning new routines and learning new paras.
Speaker 2:So that helped take a lot of the anxiety and stress away. Now, as the beginning of the year starts. The students have to learn us and we all know children, they're going to try to get away with what they can get away with and see what we're going to put up with. And so there's been some behaviors that we've seen in the school, not just in our classes but in the school and we've also talked to other co-workers, other friends, family members, and I think that that's something that is being seen and we don't know about other states and county, but at least in our county that's something that we've been seeing and hearing a lot of at the beginning of the school years having some struggles with these kids coming back from school and settling into a routine and displaying some of these unwanted behaviors.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think that what you said about settling in on a routine is what's huge, because I know we've talked a lot before about the difference as far as expectation goes in the house and in the school building. They should be different. There should be more restrictions in the school building right, because you're trying to help students learn how to operate in different settings, and home should be a place that they can go to and kind of, you know, take a breath and unwind, and not saying that kids shouldn't have direction or order. However, you know that it is important to have that place where you can just kind of let loose a little.
Speaker 2:I think there's less expectations. I know one of the common things that when teachers talk to parents, one of the common things they hear is well, I don't see that at home, and we often hear teachers that get frustrated or they don't believe the parent. I think we've even been found thinking, huh, and until we realize that well yeah, well, that does make sense, because they're not asking them to sit down and do these work tasks and, like you said, it shouldn't be like that. Of course they should have expectations at home. We're not saying that, but they're different expectations and a lot of times what's happening at school is they're being asked to do things that are not highly preferred activities.
Speaker 1:Right, right. I mean, I don't know how many times over the course of my adult life I've woke up and said I don't want to go to work today, just because I didn't feel like doing work.
Speaker 2:I don't want to write this paper this weekend, yep.
Speaker 1:See, and so that all makes sense.
Speaker 1:And so what happens is we're starting back into the school year.
Speaker 1:So where we're at, like I said earlier, we're two and a half weeks into the school year.
Speaker 1:And so now you have all of these kids from, you know, from kindergarten all the way up through 12th grade, who are now stepping back into a building where the expectations are going to be a lot higher after having months of not the same types of expectations, and with that comes pushback. And so we've seen that, we've seen the pushback in the self-contained classrooms, we've seen the pushback in the general setting. And so I think what the question is, just moving into, sliding into this first episode of the first season, let's just kind of talk a little bit about, let's talk about those behaviors, kind of at a surface level, and discuss, I mean, what are some of the things that we need to understand, some of the things that we need to do in response to those you know there's, of course there's that impact on on learning, for the student presenting the behaviors and the students in the in the classroom, for the student presenting the behaviors and the students in the classroom, and so, and then it impacts the teachers being able to get what they need to get done.
Speaker 2:And we know that each seems like each year, that there is, you know, more of that push on teachers of academics. I'm not saying academics isn't important, don't?
Speaker 1:take that, Listen who really gives a rip. If you can read.
Speaker 2:No, we're not saying that. But it seems that the curriculum and instruction is starting they're expected to do from the get-go and so it's hard for those teachers to get that routine. Because most of the time we're a little more fortunate in our setting that we already have. A lot of times we already have relationships with our students and they know our expectations when they come back.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because you'll spend multiple years with the same students and they know our expectations when they come back. They have to remind them. Yeah, because you'll spend multiple years with the same students.
Speaker 2:But in the majority of the classrooms, these students are working with new teachers and, like I said, most children are going to see what they can get away with and if they can get away with something, so they're going to test that new teacher that they have this year. And so we've talked before about the importance of having relationships, but with the rigor that is expected, it's hard to develop those relationships right from the get-go, and so they're seeing the behaviors and the disruptions and reaching out to parents, and parents are I don't know what to do, or I haven't, I haven't seen this, or this didn't happen last year, and so it's yeah, it. I think that it's a lot, a lot of that going on.
Speaker 1:Well, and then when we start to look at our specific population, our tribe, the students with special needs, it always one of the things that rings in my head very often is the conversation that we had with Heather McMillan last year, one of the greatest special education teachers I've ever met in my life. She's fantastic. She was Zander's teacher. She gets results, she pushes the kids like she's figured them out, and something that she shared with us is that that people don't learn till they're ready to learn. Right, and we can agree with that. We can look and we can see that. We see that in our adult lives, People who you know shirk off certain responsibilities until they get to a point where they're like oh wait, a minute, no, this things have to change. I'm now ready to take accountability and action, or take accountability for my actions and what I'm doing with my life and kids. Learning is the same thing. So we can have a kid in our classroom that you know they may be incredibly intelligent, but if they're not ready to learn, it's not going to happen.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:You're going to have that clash, you're going to have that Pushback.
Speaker 2:Yeah, resistance.
Speaker 1:Right, and so we look at that and we think to ourselves, okay, well, why, why, why? Why is this happening, right? And so we've already talked a little bit about that. How do we approach that, though? What do we do as parents? What do we do as special education educators? Should I just say special educators?
Speaker 1:I think that makes more sense, special educators when looking at these behaviors, because I do know this. I know that any time we want to see a change, it starts with an understanding. Right, we have to have an understanding of what's going on. One of the things that I had this conversation with somebody just the other day. I'm not a big like systems person from the standpoint of I believe that if I do X, y and Z, I'm always going to get this result. I just don't. I think there's too many variables in life to live that way, and oftentimes we have to get to know people and we have to work those. We have to work through that to get to the desired end, and in this case, we're talking about modifying behavior. So what do we need to know, like, what are some things that we need to understand to help kind of shape our scope, shape our perspective on these kids and what they're going through right now.
Speaker 2:I think one of the things you talked about was parents and teachers, and so that parent-teacher relationship and communication is important. I was having a conversation with a friend who is also a parent of a young child and their child is displaying some behaviors and there's some concern and I was really, really excited that she had said that. Well, I have a meeting with the teacher and I understand that the school has a lot to offer. So before I take further steps, I want to hear what the teacher says and what the you know the perspective of the teacher and you know she also has some things that they have changed at home with the child and they also have some strategies that they use. So it was exciting to me that she's going in there with this open mind, with this teacher, that and with this thought that she's this teacher's here to help me and my child. She's not just like complaining about my child and the behaviors, complaining about my child and the behaviors. So I think that's one of the important things to keep in mind is having that conversation and hopefully that is the case, that the teacher isn't just there trying to complain about your child. That they're like okay, let's figure out the why, like you're saying, you have to understand why this behavior is happening, because it can be a long list of things and especially when you're talking about young children, some of the things that get in their heads, that bother them, that they're like.
Speaker 2:We may finally, when we figure it out, be like, oh my gosh, that's like completely unreasonable, but to them it's not, it's a big deal. To them it, you know, couldn't be the fact that their sock has fallen into their shoe. I know that drives me crazy. However, as a small child, that can be a big deal, especially if there's a sensory issues or their shoelaces are too tight. I know as a baby our oldest Troy. Every time I put shoes on him he cried and I couldn't figure out why. Well, it was because his feet needed a little bit more work before they could go into those shoes, but like he would scream bloody murder, as soon as I took his shoes off he was fine.
Speaker 2:So finding the, the reason why they're they're um he wasn't just being a turd right, no no, because he was a pretty easy baby, so like something is wrong if he's crying like this.
Speaker 1:But yeah, it can just, it can be the simplest things. Something that we learned not too terribly long ago and something that I continue to carry with me and I know you do as well is is that the importance of listening and the importance of asking questions. You know it's very easy from a parent side to have a mindset of this is what I want for my kid, this is what I want them to accomplish, and if the teacher doesn't agree with that, then there's some serious friction. And there's some serious friction and then on the other side, when you're the teacher, you have in mind, working with this kid, everything they can accomplish and the goals that you believe they can achieve, but it may not match what the parent's thinking conversations almost like. We are dead set on convincing the other that we're right and we don't take the time to listen and to ask the questions.
Speaker 1:You know it took us years to get to a point where we were sitting in a meeting with parents and it just for whatever reason. At that time it clicked and we question what do you, what do you see for your child? Well, and what they saw and what we saw, not that one was better or worse or they were very different. Right, and there is no way that we as a team are going to achieve a goal when the goals are different, right we're. We're kind of pointing guns in different directions and pulling the trigger. We're never going to hit the bullseye, right, it's never going to happen. And so I think that what I want to really push at the end of this conversation is that teachers and parents, if we can't be and I've failed at this, right so this isn't me standing on a pedestal saying, hey, I've got it figured out, I've done it right, like I have failed this numerous times and I'm trying to get better at it.
Speaker 2:And we have, on both sides of that fence, right as parents and as teachers.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Us right now is is if we can get our teachers and our parents to walk into the meetings ready to listen, ready to hear each other, ready to ask the questions of what do you see and why? Because you know what here's. The truth is that you know we can sit all day and we can say a kid's going to be able to do this and a kid's not going to be able to do that, and there's going to be teachers that are going to have too low expectations, too high expectations. There's going to be parents in that same vein, but we never know where to meet if we don't ask the questions and we don't listen, right? So I think.
Speaker 1:Correct me if I'm wrong, but if we can give one little piece of advice rolling into this school year, it's that if the kid's going to be first and their well-being is first, we've got to be a team. We've got to be a team. So let's walk in there, b team. And oh, by the way, if you are a teacher and that student is not like, their best interest is not number one on your, on your to do list Quit, go, do something else. Don't do that to these youngins, Right? If you're just in there because you've been a teacher and this is what I do, and I'm just kind of waiting out and I'm going to make these kids listen.
Speaker 1:Go do something else, because they don't need that from you. What they need is a team, an IEP team, parents, teachers, other support staff that say our goal is to help this kid be the very best that they can be.
Speaker 2:Even before an IEP team, some of these young kids are not diagnosed or not they have not been screened, and so some of these students that are having these issues, especially the young ones, you don't have to have an IEP to have a team at school.
Speaker 2:True story you know parents ask the questions. Okay, so because, and if the teacher doesn't know and won't find out, go to the next person, talk to the guidance counselor, talk to the principal and find out what is available for your child to help your child and what's the best way to support as a team, because you have a team whether your kid has an IEP or not.
Speaker 1:So you were telling me the other day about this T-shirt. I think you said that one of your parents got all of you a t-shirt, or but it had this really great saying on it. What was it? I?
Speaker 2:think it said be kind, because you never know what another person is going through.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think that's key to keep in mind. Right, you're walking into these meetings, you're seeing these children, you're seeing the behaviors, you're seeing a lot of chaos going on and it's very important to consider them.
Speaker 2:Right, and my dad always used to say you know everyone's carrying their own sack of rocks. You never know what's in. You don't know what's in that sack of rocks, and everybody's sack of rocks is different, so don't assume that you know what's going on.
Speaker 1:Well, my dad just used to say what's wrong with you? And you know I still can't answer that question, so we are wrapping up episode one of season two.
Speaker 2:I'm so excited still. And his football season like cheers.
Speaker 1:Right Weird, but anyway we'll see you next time.